Nitrateville Correction Dept: Noah Beery Sr.

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Richard M Roberts
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Nitrateville Correction Dept: Noah Beery Sr.

Postby Richard M Roberts » Mon Sep 30, 2013 11:47 pm

Okay, Bob Fells made another uninformed asinine comment regarding Noah Beery Sr. on Nutrateville today, wondering why his career "nosedived" in the mid 30's. Hmmmm, in 1934, Noah Beery Sr made nine films, hardly a nosedive. And indeed, he was one of many American Actors who were wooed over to England in the mid-30's when the British Film Industry was making a serious attempt to compete in the International and American Markets, and to call folk like Edward G. Robinson, Robert Young, William K Howard, Douglas Fairbanks Jr, Edmund Lowe, many others who made Brit Film at the time "displaced talent" shows total ignorance of film history on either side of the pond. Beery made eight films while in England, giving several very good performances (he's terrific in KING OF THE DAMNED(1935) with Conrad Veidt, and THE FROG (1937) with Gordon Harker).

Beery indeed suffered from heart problems in his last decade, but continued to work steadily in films and radio until his death in 1946. From his return to America in 1937 until his demise, he made 28 films, of which only three were with his brother Wallace. And considering he had always been a very successful character actor, not a star, that does not indicate any particular "nosedive" in his career. In his 202 films over a long career, Noah Beery Sr was a delightful scene-stealing villain or warm character actor, depending on what the part required, and unlike his brother, a well-liked and respected actor in the Hollywood Community.

One just gets tired of seeing uninformed cattiness and baloney gossip being paraded for fact on Nutrateville, which is what you seem to get when it's not just being boring. As I have said before, I find it hilarious that these "experts" make judgement calls on the success of various actors who had long and distinguished careers when these "experts" have never come close to anything resembling that sort of success in their own lives.


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Re: Nitrateville Correction Dept: Noah Beery Sr.

Postby Gary Johnson » Sun Oct 06, 2013 4:15 pm

This thread brought to mind a broader question about actors who suffered, not a career 'nose-dive' but rather a change of momentum. I'm sure we can all think of hundreds of actors who were riding high in their profession only to find they had peaked due to mismanagement, bad choices, personal decisions or even scandal. Lew Ayres comes immediately to mind by coming out as a conscientious objector after Pearl Harbor. Despite his moral stand, the man picked the wrong era and the wrong war to exhibit his inner Buddhism.

But I have always wondered about a larger group of actors who performed yeoman's service for close to a decade propping up scores of films with their witty performances. I'm referring to the Warner Bros Stock company of the Thirties. We all know who they are, and how invaluable they became with livening up product that was cranked out at tremendous speed (The studio had an amazing success rate at turning out consistently entertaining fare during the Depression). And yet, as the Thirties came to a close Warners slowly stopped re-signing many of them, or they just opted to head out on the open market. By the time America went to war Alan Hale was one of the few mainstays who was still under contract to the studio.

But the former stock company continued to work and had long careers as their health allowed. But their worth seemed to diminish once they left Warners. Mostly because the ribald, rowdy comedies they had all appeared in were no longer made as often. Guy Kibbee moved over to MGM and was immediately turned into a wise grandfatherly-type dispensing sage advice to all of the Andy Hardy wanna-bees under contract at Metro. Frank McHugh appears in GOING MY WAY and seems to drift from comedy the rest of the decade. Hugh Herbert moved over to Universal and did stay in the comedy field during the war, but was relegated to Columbia shorts soon after. Allan Jenkens was still a bright spot in his post-Warners appearances during the war years (BALL OF FIRE (41), TORTILLA FLAT (42)...to name a few) but he began working less as the decade went on (can hardly blame him. The man was a constant workhorse for J.L. with rarely a break).

Joan Blondell writes in her autobiography how she was late to the party in becoming one of Warners many 'recalcitrant' actors on the payroll. She was always happy to be working and under contract. But once she had enough of low pay (Cagney was always riding her to stand up for her worth) and struck out on her own she found it difficult finding continuous work despite everyone knowing her comedic and dramatic worth (She's the only reason to watch ADVENTURE (46). The general consensus being that she should had ended up with Gable rather than that stiff Garson).

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Re: Nitrateville Correction Dept: Noah Beery Sr.

Postby Richard M Roberts » Sun Oct 06, 2013 11:12 pm

Gary Johnson wrote:This thread brought to mind a broader question about actors who suffered, not a career 'nose-dive' but rather a change of momentum. I'm sure we can all think of hundreds of actors who were riding high in their profession only to find they had peaked due to mismanagement, bad choices, personal decisions or even scandal. Lew Ayres comes immediately to mind by coming out as a conscientious objector after Pearl Harbor. Despite his moral stand, the man picked the wrong era and the wrong war to exhibit his inner Buddhism.

But I have always wondered about a larger group of actors who performed yeoman's service for close to a decade propping up scores of films with their witty performances. I'm referring to the Warner Bros Stock company of the Thirties. We all know who they are, and how invaluable they became with livening up product that was cranked out at tremendous speed (The studio had an amazing success rate at turning out consistently entertaining fare during the Depression). And yet, as the Thirties came to a close Warners slowly stopped re-signing many of them, or they just opted to head out on the open market. By the time America went to war Alan Hale was one of the few mainstays who was still under contract to the studio.

But the former stock company continued to work and had long careers as their health allowed. But their worth seemed to diminish once they left Warners. Mostly because the ribald, rowdy comedies they had all appeared in were no longer made as often. Guy Kibbee moved over to MGM and was immediately turned into a wise grandfatherly-type dispensing sage advice to all of the Andy Hardy wanna-bees under contract at Metro. Frank McHugh appears in GOING MY WAY and seems to drift from comedy the rest of the decade. Hugh Herbert moved over to Universal and did stay in the comedy field during the war, but was relegated to Columbia shorts soon after. Allan Jenkens was still a bright spot in his post-Warners appearances during the war years (BALL OF FIRE (41), TORTILLA FLAT (42)...to name a few) but he began working less as the decade went on (can hardly blame him. The man was a constant workhorse for J.L. with rarely a break).

Joan Blondell writes in her autobiography how she was late to the party in becoming one of Warners many 'recalcitrant' actors on the payroll. She was always happy to be working and under contract. But once she had enough of low pay (Cagney was always riding her to stand up for her worth) and struck out on her own she found it difficult finding continuous work despite everyone knowing her comedic and dramatic worth (She's the only reason to watch ADVENTURE (46). The general consensus being that she should had ended up with Gable rather than that stiff Garson).




Johnson, this is the same type of bonehead thinking many bonehead film buffs fall into today like when you hear someone bemoaning poor old broken down Buster Keaton who became a drunken derelict after MGM let him go and he never worked much again except for a few Frankie and Annette pictures. Every one of the people you mentioned worked basically until they were planted or their health sidelined them into retirement. The only reason you think the Warners Stock company folk seem to lose career momentum after they escaped (and escaped is the word, because you can bet the minute they got out from under the infamous seven-year Simon Legree contracts Jack Warner was famous for in the 30’s, they were making more money freelancing) is because after decades of Turner Classic Movies which has kept the Warner films before our eyes steadily, sometimes the work these folk did afterwards is more scattered.

After Warners, Guy Kibbee starred in the Scattersgood Baines series for RKO, and worked steadily in features until his health declined and he retired in the early 50’s (and his brother Milton Kibbee made nearly 400 film appearances before he retired around the same time). Allan Jenkins and Frank McHugh were always busy, not only in films and television, but also doing stage work (which is usually all-but-invisible to your average film historian, especially if it was non-Broadway work. No one has yet put together anything resembling a decent database of West-Coast Theater or National Touring Company productions). Hugh Herbert was also busy doing stage and revue work when he wasn’t doing Columbia shorts or supporting roles (wasn’t he involved with the Ken Murray Blackouts or some such regular LA revue show?), and the only reason Alan Hale Sr. remained at Warners through the forties was because he didn’t sign with them until 1937 and things got easier there in the forties when the Unions came in and the sixteen hour workdays disappeared, so he hung around there until he croaked.

So many bonehead film buffs who don’t know better have this idea of “stardom” that only existed in the minds of those who read tinseltown screen mags and think everyone lived in Beverly Hills mansions until their careers “nosedived”, then they became drunken derelicts on skid row. The average lifespan of a “star” career is seven years, (basically a generation), then they either kept working as character actors or bit players or they got into another line of work. The number of actual tragic cases in Hollywood is probably no more than in any other Industry, and a lot of those would have been tragic whatever profession they chose. Even Joan Blondell had a good ten year run as a star, unfortunately most of it as a Warners slave, but she then segued into character parts and stage work and again, worked steadily until the day she died. Her financial ups and downturns appear to have been caused more by marital mistakes, but she survived, and she was the only actual “star” you mentioned. The rest you mentioned were always just working actors, none of them ever came close to starving, and all of them had long careers as working actors that lasted multiple decades, which put them ahead of the other 99.5 percent of the acting profession.



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Re: Nitrateville Correction Dept: Noah Beery Sr.

Postby Louie Despres » Mon Oct 07, 2013 8:20 am

I will add this as I know his career the best, El Brendel had a meteoric rise to stardom at Fox in 1929, appeared in loads of films, but his dialect style started to wane with the public, and his appearances in features became less and less by the mid 30's, but he never stopped working. Newspapers and his scrapbooks show he was constantly doing stage shows and live appearances all over the US with his wife Flo (often driving themselves, as his home movies reveal). Not a Hollywood party guy, he invested well and seemed to move into newer and larger houses every couple of years.

I will say, I have a couple of contracts from stage appearances he made in 1932 and for a 7 day stint in Baltimore, he earned $4,000. Not bad in Depression-era America.

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Re: Nitrateville Correction Dept: Noah Beery Sr.

Postby Gary Johnson » Mon Oct 07, 2013 5:34 pm

Sorry Richard, but once again you are responding to something you 'think' I said, rather than what I actually wrote (He does this to me a lot with three am wake up calls to tell me I was wrong about something I said during the Carter Administration).
I'm well aware that all members of that stock company continued to work for many decades (outside of death). I even stated that fact....

But the former stock company continued to work and had long careers as their health allowed. But their worth seemed to diminish once they left Warners. Mostly because the ribald, rowdy comedies they had all appeared in were no longer made as often.


Now, perhaps 'their worth seemed to diminish' was the wrong choice of words. It's just that their screen appearances became less memorable to me as the Forties progressed. And this from a group of actors who routinely stole every scene they appeared in during the Thirties.

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Re: Nitrateville Correction Dept: Noah Beery Sr.

Postby Richard M Roberts » Mon Oct 07, 2013 11:16 pm

Gary Johnson wrote:Sorry Richard, but once again you are responding to something you 'think' I said, rather than what I actually wrote (He does this to me a lot with three am wake up calls to tell me I was wrong about something I said during the Carter Administration).
I'm well aware that all members of that stock company continued to work for many decades (outside of death). I even stated that fact....

But the former stock company continued to work and had long careers as their health allowed. But their worth seemed to diminish once they left Warners. Mostly because the ribald, rowdy comedies they had all appeared in were no longer made as often.


Now, perhaps 'their worth seemed to diminish' was the wrong choice of words. It's just that their screen appearances became less memorable to me as the Forties progressed. And this from a group of actors who routinely stole every scene they appeared in during the Thirties.



Well, their screen appearances become less memorable as the forties progressed because films in general become less memorable as the forties progress. They still had to make livings, didn't they? "Worth seemed to diminish" was indeed the wrong choice of words.

It's also why they all got so busy in Television and elsewhere, the studios were making a hell of a lot less movies, a trend which continued down to present day.


And don't get cute about "three o clock in the morning phone calls". Though we've bantered and argued through the written word on many forums and privately over the years, we've actually spoken face to face only once or twice, and that was just at this last Slapsticon.



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Re: Nitrateville Correction Dept: Noah Beery Sr.

Postby Jim Roots » Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:01 am

Richard M Roberts wrote:Though we've bantered and argued through the written word on many forums and privately over the years, we've actually spoken face to face only once or twice, and that was just at this last Slapsticon.



RICHARD M ROBERTS


Were blows exchanged on that occasion?

Jim
When you're surrounded by vultures, playing dead is not a good strategy.

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Re: Nitrateville Correction Dept: Noah Beery Sr.

Postby Richard M Roberts » Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:14 am

Jim Roots wrote:
Richard M Roberts wrote:Though we've bantered and argued through the written word on many forums and privately over the years, we've actually spoken face to face only once or twice, and that was just at this last Slapsticon.



RICHARD M ROBERTS


Were blows exchanged on that occasion?

Jim



Don't be a goofus, but it did seem strange actually speaking to him, almost got my laptop out to answer his questions, but I remembered once seeing two film nerds actually texting each other when they were standing about two feet apart and decided against it.


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Re: Nitrateville Correction Dept: Noah Beery Sr.

Postby Joe Migliore » Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:39 pm

Jim Roots wrote:
Were blows exchanged on that occasion?


The shrill faction of Nitrateville aren't afraid of getting punched; they're afraid of a contrary opinion, particularly if it's coming from someone who has put in the hours and done the heavy lifting. While I find that attitude baffling, (isn't that precisely the opinion that means something?), it's apparently terrifying to people who've decided there's nothing left to learn. People tend to prefer simplicity over complexity, and too many people will take bad data over no data every time.

Another thing that should be obvious, is that those of us who fixate on the comedies of the silent era probably have a healthy sense of humor in the first place. There are people on the other site who seem literally to have no sense of humor, and no metric for weighing the value of a statement made in jest.

I guess what I'm trying to say is "Slapsticon Rules!" It is our Woodstock.

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Re: Nitrateville Correction Dept: Noah Beery Sr.

Postby Gary Johnson » Wed Oct 09, 2013 12:22 am

Where did that outburst come from??

Back to the matter on hand -- which is not Noah Berry Sr. I never found him that interesting of a screen presence.....all bluster and ham. It's the same tactic his brother used but with much better results, for some reason.
No, my Man of the Hour of this thread is Frank McHugh. One of the great 'comic reliefs' of the cinema. For me he could do no wrong during the '30's. I go out of my way to watch THE IRISH IN US (35) just for his comic interactions with his Celtic family, not to mention Alan Jenkins hilarious turn as a punch-drunk boxer. And they didn't have to be comedies -- BULLETS OR BALLOTS (36), FOUR DAUGHTERS (38) and THE ROARING TWENTIES (39) all benefited from McHugh's presence. In fact, his death in ROARING TWENTIES was as emotionally draining as the star's was two reels later.

And then, as Richard states, 'times change, comedies change...." Hawks was always scrambling trying to find a good screwball comedy script in the post-war era when few were being written. And whenever someone thought they found one Cary Grant was the only go-to guy to get it made. And considering some of the punk comedies he made in the early '50's it's sad to think that they were the best of the lot.

So yes, Frank McHugh continues to work, in both film and television -- but he was definitely underused and undervalued. He makes an appearance in an episode of ROUTE 66 in the early sixties. He plays a bar fly horning in on the conversation between our two heroes and the gorgeous gal they are both trying to impress. He gives a fine performance of a henpecked husband lamenting that his wife doesn't understand him, and equates it to the beautiful young girl next to him who has her entire life ahead of her. And then the scene turns ugly when George Maharis' character turns uncharacteristically cruel and pushes the drunk away because he sees he is losing the girls interest. Now I obviously haven't seen every TV appearance by McHugh (has anyone ever caught his remake of THREE MEN ON A HORSE (57), if it even exists?) but he seemed to have turned away from his bread and butter more and more after leaving Warners -- STATE FAIR (45), MY SON JOHN (52), A LION IN THE STREET (53), MIGHTY JOE YOUNG (49) . His presence doesn't actually help produce a lot of yuks in those films.

I always thought that GOING MY WAY (44) was an albatross to him. He continued on the sweet and sentimental line, rather than the wry and cynical. I guess that is a prerequisite of age. To wit; He gave great support to William Powell in 1940's I LOVE YOU AGAIN and then they met again seven years later in THE HOODLUM PRIEST and nobody wins. His few bright spots for me in the post war era are MISS GRANT TAKES RICHMOND (49), where he is back in his element playing opposite James Gleason as a couple of bookies, and THE LAST HURRAH (58) - since I'll take Ford's nostalgia and sentimentality over any other directors'.


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